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Thread: Heliophorus epicles or Heliophorus ila?

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    Default Heliophorus epicles or Heliophorus ila?

    Three images of the same individual from Doi Phu Kha. H. epicles should be "easy" to separate as the hindwing border at space 6 protrudes farther than on ila (or indicus). However, on this individual it does not seem to be a clear cut case. My gut feeling is that this is H. ila, but would be interested if the border at space 6 protruded enough for it to be considered H. epicles.

    restricted IMG_2484.JPG

    IMG_2482.JPG

    IMG_2483.JPG

  2. #2
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    The 3 Heliophorus epicles, ila & indicus are very similar.

    I think your 3rd pix is something else.
    The tails are short & the lower margin of the FW is excavated.
    It looks to be Heliophorus eventa.
    http://butterfliesvietnam.blogspot.m...-sapphire.html


    Of the 3 the male of H. epicles may have the space 6 border more protruding inwards.
    The female of all 3 species have this protrusion much less.

    Heliophorus epicles latilimbata
    FW white lunulate marks in space 2 & 3 more chevron in shape.
    http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/med...unte_ai827.jpg
    http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/med...a_7/tbf131.jpg
    http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/med...e738f6b6-1.jpg
    http://www.learnaboutbutterflies.com...09767-001a.jpg
    http://www.learnaboutbutterflies.com...09658-001a.jpg

    Heliophorus ila nolus.
    FW white lunulate marks in space 2 & 3 flat ,ie as short bars, that in space 3 often obsolete.
    https://species.wikimedia.org/wiki/H...CC_3043to4.jpg
    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-0PE2s45hdV...-%2B1A7561.jpg
    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-JxFDXK0W1s...la%2Bnolus.jpg
    ssp matsumurae Taiwan.
    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-6DSjBJVnZY...00/L04-1-1.jpg

    Heliophorus indicus.ID marks uncertain.
    http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/#!/...phorus-indicus


    1 & 2 look to be H. ila nolus.

    TL Seow: Cheers.
    Last edited by Psyche; 10-Dec-2017 at 10:08 AM. Reason: image mixup

  3. #3
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    Many thanks for the feedback. I checked the timestamps on the three photos, and actually the time of the third photo was in between the other two by only a few secods, so I think the shortened appearance is mainly due to the more oblique angle of the photo (which is also out of focus, which doesn't help). Certainly we didn't knowingly see any eventa in the area and we were there some time, and we are pretty familiar with that species from Doi Pha Hom Pok.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveChiangMai View Post
    Many thanks for the feedback. I checked the timestamps on the three photos, and actually the time of the third photo was in between the other two by only a few secods, so I think the shortened appearance is mainly due to the more oblique angle of the photo (which is also out of focus, which doesn't help). Certainly we didn't knowingly see any eventa in the area and we were there some time, and we are pretty familiar with that species from Doi Pha Hom Pok.
    You are right. There is a costal injury mark & two scratches in space 2 & 3 which are matching with pix 2.

    TL Seow: Cheers.

    PS. On reflection it is probably H. epicles..
    All valid pix of H. ila shows the white mark in space 2 to be straight whereas this is slightly chevron.
    The off angle of the shot seem to have flattened it.
    There is still H. indicus to consider.

    PS2; It looks like the male H. indicus have the FW cilia barely checquered plus more prominent postdiscal dark dashes, so that rules it out.
    http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/med...ndhi_ar532.jpg
    https://www.thaibutterflies.com/Butt...horus-indicus/
    Last edited by Psyche; 10-Dec-2017 at 10:21 AM. Reason: PS2

  5. #5
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    Many thanks for the feedback.
    Could there be some variation in whether these marks are straight or more chevron like?
    Here's an image of lla, which is considered reliably as ila, with distinctly chevron like marks:
    https://wingscales.com/Lycaenidae/He...#photo-gallery
    Last edited by DaveChiangMai; 10-Dec-2017 at 11:37 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveChiangMai View Post
    Many thanks for the feedback.
    There is some variation in whether these marks are straight or more chevron like. Here's an image of lla, which is considered reliably as ila, with distinctly chevron like marks:
    https://wingscales.com/Lycaenidae/He...#photo-gallery

    Yes, I am aware of this image.
    It is a female ,whereas yours is a male.
    The same thing goes for H. indicus where the FW spot 2 is slightly chevron in the female with the rounded FW.


    Other pix.
    Male H. epicles tweediei Malaya.
    http://www.learnaboutbutterflies.com...%20epicles.htm
    Male H. epicles chinensis Yunnan, HK.
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8248/8...b4a839862c.jpg
    https://static.inaturalist.org/photo...jpg?1444698896

    Male H. ila malaya & female. Malaya.
    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-C4U-nlZhs...0/DSC_2105.JPG
    https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-j3QLJ7iux...0/DSC_0771.JPG
    Male & female H. ila matsumurae Taiwan.
    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-6DSjBJVnZY...00/L04-1-1.jpg
    http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2738/...f70a21cd78.jpg

    Admittedly it is very tough to tell for sure.
    From the above pix there is a stronger suggestion for H. epicles.

    TL Seow: Cheers.
    Last edited by Psyche; 10-Dec-2017 at 09:22 PM.

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