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Thread: ID Help Request!!

  1. #1
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    Default ID Help Request!!

    Dear Seow sir,
    A request from NE India..
    Not sure whether they are Neptis hylas/sappho??
    I have a big confusion among them on the UP...

    Here..

    No.1
    _DSC1101.JPG

    No.2
    _DSC1240.JPG

    Thanks in advance
    Atanu Bora

  2. #2
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    Both are Neptis sappho.
    1. female probably as dsf with wider markings.
    2. male probably as wsf with narrower markings.

    Both species are similar with the broken bone FW cell-bar.

    Neptis hylas kamarupa. FW , the 4 postdiscal spots widen (ie elongate) as short bars; underside tawny brown
    http://wingscales.com/content/record/425-1-84975.jpg
    http://www.tataiwildlife.info/butter...ailor)%208.jpg

    Neptis sappho astola; FW, the 4 postdiscal spots narrower, more rounded & irregular; underside rusty brown.
    https://c2.staticflickr.com/2/1716/2...239c0f25_b.jpg
    http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/med...8eeb1737-1.jpg
    http://yutaka.it-n.jp/lim1/720140010.html

    TL Seow: Cheers.

  3. #3
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    I guess Neptis sappho is not a very rare species, may be even more common than Neptis hylas in some areas of our region..but perhaps we often misjudge them...However now I am confident I will be able to differentiate them now with your described keys...

    Thanks a lot!!
    Atanu Bora: Cheers☺

  4. #4
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    Default ID Correction.

    No. 1 should be Neptis hylas kamarupa.

    The wingshape is distorted ie held slightly up so all the markings are shortened.

    The features that indicate this is N. hylas kamarupa are.

    1.The FW apex in ssp kamarupa typically lack the topmost submarginal spot ;this is almost always present in sappho.

    2. The upper two of the FW postdiscal spots spots 2 & 3,are very close ; they are well-spaced out in sappho.

    3. The triangular cell-end spot is short although this is due partly to distortion ; with a sharper point in sappho.


    The ssp varmona of N. hylas in central & south India is different.

    1.The FW apex is fully spotted (submarginally)
    2. The topmost of th FW postdiscal spot (spot 3) is often short. ( Note the postdiscal spots are in spaces 1a, 1b, 2, & 3.)
    http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/#!/sp/480/Neptis-hylas

    TL Seow: Cheers.

  5. #5
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    Default

    Then this is well possibly Neptis hylas??

    Common Sailer(Neptis hylas).JPG

    Thanks in advance
    Atanu Bora: Cheers☺

  6. #6
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    Yess it is Neptis hylas.

    The FW postdiscal spots especially spot 2 (largest) is very elongate although the spots are well separated.

    There are always a lot of little variations in some examples which may be confusing at first.

    TL Seow : Cheers.

  7. #7
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    No. 5. Neptis hylas??
    The upper two of the FW postdiscal spots 2 & 3, are very close??

    12980460_598281117002921_732747711_n.jpg

    N0. 6. Neptis hylas??
    The FW postdiscal spot 2 (largest) is very elongate, though well spaced??

    12980649_598282923669407_712287215_n.jpg

    Thanks in advance
    Atanu Bora: Cheers
    Last edited by Saffron; 17-Apr-2016 at 06:29 PM.

  8. #8
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    The last one (no.6) possibly be a variation of N. hylas, though the upper two poardiscal spots looks well separated...as the spot at 2 is very elongated, so i think it is a hylas...need your expert views on that sir..

    Thanks in advance
    Atanu Bora

  9. #9
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    Post 7.

    5 & 6 are both N. hylas.
    There is a fair bit of variation. Also two ssp. armona & kamarupa probably overlaps in your area.

    The ID features for N. sappho astola whose features are more stable.
    1. Markings are typically narrower & small.
    2. FW apex ; the submarginal spots are almost always full ie right to the top.
    3. FW postsiscal spots are mostly rounded & well separated ; none are wide ie elongate sideway.
    4. The HW series of spots (upperside) are low & flat.
    http://yutaka.it-n.jp/lim1/720140010.html

    TL Seow: Cheers.

  10. #10
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    Things are very much clear now for me...though i know there will always be some individuals that will create confusion first, but after gaining so much of knowledge from you about these two similar looking species, I am now much more confident about their identification...

    Thanks a lot sir...
    Atanu Bora: Cheers☺

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