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Thread: Lascar for ID

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2004
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    Singapore
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    15,643

    Default Lascar for ID

    Dr Seow, I've put this down earlier as P. hordonia. Shot back in 2009. Any views?

    CommonLascar-KSKForums.jpg
    Khew SK
    Butterflies of Singapore BLOG
    Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Malaysia
    Posts
    5,896

    Default

    It should be the female P. sandaka.

    There is a tremendous amount of confusion between the two species.
    As the male genitalia are similar one wonders if anyone have done a DNA analysis.

    The situation is complicated in the north where there are wsf & dsf (grey band narrower).

    Basically I will stick with the forms in P. Malaysia & Singapore where there is only wsf. It is however possible for dsf & intermediates to occur here.

    The typical males are not difficult to separate.

    P. sandaka sandaka wsf .
    FW orange submarginal band intact , continuous & generally wider the inner grey band.
    Male FW postdiscal band ( consisting of a round head & a foot running along the lower margin)genrally large & long.
    HW male with a white speculum which may be visible as a white line or highlight below the FW.
    http://nlliew66butterflies.blogspot....a-sandaka.html
    Singapore males.
    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_rzo8wjfyC...erick_02_c.jpg
    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-76dEIhRQ1...mon+Lascar.jpg

    Probable females Singapore.
    https://www.butterflycircle.com/chec...6_puddling.jpg
    https://www.butterflycircle.com/chec...erick%20Ho.jpg


    P. hordonia hordonia wsf.
    FW inner grey submarginal band broad & wider than the orange band to the outside, in dsf the grey band is narrower & may be beaded.
    FW postdiscal band with a smaller & shorter foot slanting inwards.
    HW with a small grey speculum.
    http://nlliew66butterflies.blogspot....-hardonia.html
    Taman Negara.
    https://www.learnaboutbutterflies.co...nia%20001a.jpg
    Singapore male.
    https://www.samuibutterflies.com/02_...iadindinga.jpg
    https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-oiSX3-kyP...ascar-KSK4.jpg
    Female, Thailand (with orange band obscure. )
    https://i.pinimg.com/originals/0a/f2...fd389661b5.jpg
    Female, Java.
    https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ELNd5T1m_...IMG_7404e1.JPG

    Probale female Singapore but labelled as P. sandaka Note wide grey band.
    https://singapore.biodiversity.onlin...0472?imageId=0


    If Fleming's collection is accessible in the Museum , you could take a look at the females of both species.


    TL Seow; Cheers.
    Last edited by Psyche; 20-Dec-2020 at 05:15 PM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
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    Default

    Thanks Dr Seow! Will go take photos of the Fleming Coll, when I have a chance to, and then do some more comparisons. Indeed these two species are so alike as to have been missed or mis-identified.
    Khew SK
    Butterflies of Singapore BLOG
    Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try

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