Id request for Telicota

[Ngangom Aomoa]

Requesting for Id for these Telicota species, all taken from NE India.

1a
26642
1b
26643

2a
26644
2b
26645

3
26646

4
26647

5
26648

6
26649

7
26650

Expecting last four to be T. ohara.

Many thanks

[Psyche]

1. Cephrenes acalle.

The male is readily IDed by the uhderside veins being all black.
https://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Cephrenes%20acalle%20niasicus/CA_male_Horace_03.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sp/1038/Cephrenes-acalle

[Psyche]

2, 3, & 4.
Telicota bambusae .

T. bambusae is relatively small with short FWs. FW 15mm.
FW spot 2 & 3 are rather wide , much wider than spots 4 & 5.
The male brand is straight .
Base of space 2 may be black or shaded orange.
HW typically with a stronger inner rounded notch of the upper end.
https://www.flutters.org/home/photogallery/plog-content/images/butterfliesbrnbspnbspnbsphesperiidae-the-skippers-br/subfamily-hesperiinae--brnbspnbspnbsp-genus-cephrenestelicota--palm-dart-/dark-palm-dart__telicota-ancilla_ashish-tiple.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/TelicotaBambusae/01TelicotaBambusae_KSaji_ad012.jpg


T. linna.
Much larger FW 18mm.
FW band, spots 2 & 3 narrow ;HW with a similar notch.
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-wU0gNp51E3U/VgOg89qI7cI/AAAAAAAAOQg/t1opVeXR03U/s1600/Telicota-linna-Males---Horace-Tan.jpg
https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-79Gj7N-1GXc/Vz1Td5Ld2HI/AAAAAAAAmR4/95Ux0hx6rvQBix7nmXm2PYZenG8olIQ2wCLcB/s1600/TL_male_01.jpg


T. besta;
Male brand arcuate placed nearer the inner margin of black space.
Base of space 2 always orange.
UnH veins lightly dark dusted.
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-6-BjVfqOIQ0/U1vGug7ph3I/AAAAAAAAdO0/Emv5HEJEs0M/s1600/TB_adult_male_up_01.jpg
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-NbpYa8XexNw/VJQtyK97NHI/AAAAAAAASl0/i77WR2aduOU/s1600/DSC_0294.JPG

[Psyche]

5. Cephrenes acalle.

The appearance can varies widely.
Underside band edged in black spots , on the HW both inner & outer margins.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/CephrenesAcalle/01CephrenesAcalle_KrushnameghKunte_ai833.jpg

Similar .Cephrenes trichopepla.
FW spots 4 & 5 are always wide.
https://www.discoverlife.org/IM/I_JSA/0044/640/Cephrenes_trichopepla,_Yellow_Palm_Dart,I_JSA4404. jpg


Telicota colon
https://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Telicota%20colon%20stinga/Telicota-colon2-KSK.jpg
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JCIq17YMtX0/T4BMP2yGX4I/AAAAAAAAFrI/_53XDHovvNs/s1600/DSC_5034+Telicota+colon+stinga.jpg

[Psyche]

6. Probably Telicota ohara.
HW band upper/inner margin straight without a notch.

UpF male brand very narrow & straight.
Upper/inner margin of HW band typically without a notch but this seem to varies & some examples have notch similar to the other species.

This male have a HW upper/inner margin notch but not rounded in appearance.
http://butterfliesvietnam.blogspot.com/2015/08/118-telicota-hoara-narrow-branded-palm.html

Males.
https://thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Telicota-ohara-1.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-UXgOiYLjRdE/VKqv1fAR_pI/AAAAAAAATSQ/w63Sj3S73MM/s1600/DSC_0008.JPG


7. This has the usual rounded notch on the HW band inner margin.
Should be T. bambusae.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Ngangom Aomoa]

Thanks a lot for the ID and pointers.

Warm regards
Aomoa

[Ngangom Aomoa]

Dug out one more specimen from my old photos, and unable to pin point the species. Requesting help to id...
Photo taken in Assam, India in the month of February.

8a 26682
8b 26683
8c 26684
8d 26685

Regards
Aomoa

[Psyche]

Post 7.

They are all Telicota bambusae male.

he male brand is straightb & lies closer to the outer border of the black space , ie nearer the termen or outer margin.
The spots may have vein stripes.
Thre is a patch of yellow scales at the base of space 2, which in the male T. bambusae may or may not be present.
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Dark_Palm_Dart_Telicota_bambusae_by_Dr_Raju_K asambe_DSCN4271_(10).jpg
https://www.flutters.org/home/photogallery/plog-content/images/butterfliesbrnbspnbspnbsphesperiidae-the-skippers-br/subfamily-hesperiinae--brnbspnbspnbsp-genus-cephrenestelicota--palm-dart-/dark-palm-dart__telicota-ancilla_ashish-tiple.jpg
Taiwan
https://www.flickriver.com/photos/tags/telicotabambusae/interesting/


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Ngangom Aomoa]

Thanks a lot sir.

As it seems, I am going to take my own sweet time to learn IDing these orange skippers (but orions are clear to me now).

Best regards
Aomoa

[Ngangom Aomoa]

Dear Dr Seow,

Here I am adding some more for confirmation and identification. I am still finding it a bit difficult to ID these orange skippers even though you ve given detailed descriptions. Please help.

9. Cephrenes acalle?
28060

10. P confucius?
28061

11.a. Potanthus lydia?
28062

11.b.same specimen as 11.a
28063

12. Potanthus pseudomaesa?
28064

13.a. T ohara?
28065

13.b.same specimen as 13.a
28066

14. a.
28067

14. b. same specimen as 14.a
28068

15. Looks like printing mistake..
28069

Regards
Aomoa

[Psyche]

Post 10.

The Potanthus are extremely difficult as usual .
I will leave them for last.

9 is Cephrenes acalle.
In India can be quite variable. The veins are usually sharply black.
Singapore.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Cephrenes%20acalle%20niasicus/CA_male_Horace_02.jpg
India.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/118_30939-644-5b37a26f33b56-1.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/218_14701-588-580f6c9524f9f-1.jpg

13 & 14.
Both are male Telicota ohara.
Male brand very narrow & straight.
UnH band inner margin somewhat straight.
P. Malaysia.
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-UXgOiYLjRdE/VKqv1fAR_pI/AAAAAAAATSQ/w63Sj3S73MM/s1600/DSC_0008.JPG
Thailand.
https://thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Telicota-ohara-1.jpg
Cambodia.
http://butterfliesvietnam.blogspot.com/2015/08/118-telicota-hoara-narrow-branded-palm.html

[Psyche]

http://www.butterflycircle.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=28061&d=1665589333

11. Should be correct as Potanthus confucius.

The abdominal end is yellow ,although the basal black band is thicker than usual.
The FW band is more or less continuous.Width is variable.

Male ssp diana S. India.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/PotanthuSp_GirishMohan_an073.jpg
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Potanthus_at_Nayikayam_Thattu.jpg
Male ssp. angustata Taiwan
https://kmweb.coa.gov.tw/files/butterfly_illustration/13/butterfly2014_013_99_m.jpg

The ssp. in your area should be dushta which often have wider bands but quite variable.
http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/92790010.html

The male of P. nesta may have a continuous narrow FW band but the subapical spots are often grouped in a 'V' & the HW upper spot does not project out much.
http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/92800001.html
https://thaibutterflies.com/Butterflies/potanthus-nesta/

[Psyche]

http://www.butterflycircle.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=28062&d=1665589387
http://www.butterflycircle.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=28063&d=1665589407

11. Possibly Potanthus mingo male.
Salient points.
The abdominal end is black or heavily black -banded.
The colour is rather yellow.
The ubderside appear to be rather dark shaded mainly.

Potanthus lydia, sp lydia is described as yellower than ssp fraseri which is more tawny.
The underside of P. lydia is not so dark & in a worn specimen would be very light.
The FW band of P. lydia is also mid heavy , ie widest in spots 2 & 3.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/94_23515-769-5a47807a03494-1.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/94_23515-769-5a47807a03494-2.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/94_23514-507-5a477f64e3380-1.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/94_23514-507-5a477f64e3380-2.jpg
http://www.samuibutterflies.com/expeditions/hesperiidae/potanthuslydia/

Potanthus mingo is described as yellow.
The FW band is more balanced, & the underside is typicaly more heavily dark shaded with vaque spots.
Smaller FW 12mm vs P. lydia FW 15mm.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-f3wB2A2ujBs/TljGL_hdu_I/AAAAAAAABdc/afUjssvXasc/s1600/_MG_1531.jpg
http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/92810010.html

[Psyche]

http://www.butterflycircle.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=28064&d=1665589444

12, Probably male Potanthus palnia.
P. palnia is larger FW 15mm vs P. pseudomaesa at 13mm.

P. pseudomaesa.
FW spots 4 & 5 with minimal overlap, spots 2 & 3 with concave outer margins.
Sri lanka.
https://slbutterflies.lk/storage/app/public/butterflies/b1492795816.JPG
http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/92740010.html


P.palnia.
FW with spot 5 smaller than spot 4.
Spots 2 & 3 with straight margina.
Veins crossing the FW band more distinctly dark.
Underside dark shaded with a greenish tinge.
Cambodia male.
https://inaturalist-open-data.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/96773513/large.jpg
https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4536/37999817064_e5eb33ea48_b.jpg
Kerala male.
https://live.staticflickr.com/5832/30430140096_c16e1ae172_b.jpg

[Psyche]

http://www.butterflycircle.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=28069&d=1665589666

15. Female with much reduced markings probably Potanthus lydia.

Reduced markings are sometimes seen in P. trachala, lydia & a few other.
The wider spots 2 & 3 & very thin spot in space 1b suggest P. lydia.
In fact a similar individual from Hong Kong had been identified as likely P. lydia.
Hong Kong.
https://old.hkls.org/news/9_2007/P.%20lydia.JPG
https://old.hkls.org/news/9_2007/9_2007.htm



TL Seow: Cheers.

[Ngangom Aomoa]

Thanks a lot Dr. Seow. The last one is rather interesting.

I am also getting slowly acquainted with these darts. Once I use to ignore them, but now they are my prime target during trips. All thanks to you.

Regards
Aomoa

[Psyche]

Potanthus is a fascinating genus but there are so many misidentifications on the web that it becomes extremely challenging.

Evans set himself an enormous task covering the Hesperiids over a vast area.
With reginal differences & seasonal variants, description can become confusing.

As an example of the difficulty even with common species, consider P. trachala & pseudomaesa.

I used to link the website below as an example of P. trachala.
Now looking at it I believe it is P. pseudomaesa.
https://lepidoptera.eu/species/12023


P. trachala is common in SE Asia. abdominal end black-banded.
Singapore male.
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/_yzw2AzY2du4/TR38IjsxkHI/AAAAAAAAFbU/q8mjxJswym0/s1600/PotanthusM01a.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_yzw2AzY2du4/TR31LlsMSXI/AAAAAAAAFbM/Jl1CsqKypAg/s1600/Potanthus_male_upperside_02.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/736x/8c/bd/70/8cbd702e535779b37521f7b0db7b591d.jpg
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-kvlAhJLLsd0/VAxf7FbehUI/AAAAAAAAQFc/hP3tC8esw5s/s1600/HFH3746-Potanthus-trachala-tytleri.jpg

FW 14/15 mm. FW band very narrow ;spots 2 & 3 quadrate with excavated margins. spot 1b much narrowed in the upper half ;spots 4 & 5 fully detacned.
HW with the upper spot projected out strongly.
Underside heavier dark shading ,edging spots more diffuse.
Female with the FW spots 2 & 3 with straighter margins ;spots 4 & 5widely detached.
India.
https://live.staticflickr.com/2730/4261912175_bfe57d293d_b.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/potanthus-trachala


Potanthus pseudomaesa. Abdominal end black-banded.
FW band wider ,spots 2 & 3 oblong with excavate margins ,& spot 1b more rectangular.
FW spots 4 & 5 with little overlap with the spots above & below them.
HW with the upper spot strongly projected out as in trachala.
Undrside ground less dark but spots edging the bands sharper.
Sri lanka ,male.
https://slbutterflies.lk/storage/app/public/butterflies/b1492795816.JPG
India male.
https://farm66.static.flickr.com/65535/52357461936_9926fd9e83.jpg
Female.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/observation/Potanthus%20spp.%20_1665190495_236702.jpg

Thailand. ( P. trachala for comparison)http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/92730010.html

Note the male from Lam Dong (supplied by a colleague ) can not be P. pseudomaesa.The FW shape & FW cellbars also indicate it is a female.
http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/92740010.html

( Similar looking P. pallida; FW spots 4 & 5 often more detached; Spots 1b, 2, & 3 wider; FW cell black hole large in both sexes.
Male on the right.
https://live.staticflickr.com/4007/4261960169_78cc85b483_b.jpg
http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/92720001.html.)



If you do get some good shots ,we might just be able to clear the confusions of species like P. nesta, mara ,sita & flava.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[Ngangom Aomoa]

Indeed a very interesting group. And if we know where and what to look for, it looks possible to id them from photographs.

In view of your last post, I was rechecking my photos and found one confusing one.

This was IDed as P trachala female before, but the spot in space 1b looks quite large. Please ve a look.

16.a
28078

16.b
28079

regards

[Psyche]

Post 18.

You are right.
This looks like P. trachala because of the detached spots 4 & 5, but spot 1b is wide .
It should be a female P. pseudomaesa.

In Singapore with only 7 species, P. trachala tytleri is hard to be mis-iDed.
Males.
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1898/42653386130_9d2e6e499a_b.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Potanthus%20trachala%20tytleri/Potanthus_male_upperside_02.jpg
https://inaturalist-open-data.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/7703827/large.jpg
Females.
https://inaturalist-open-data.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/212486560/large.jpg
Female right.
https://inaturalist-open-data.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/79222671/large.jpg

Compare P. pseudomaesa.
Male.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ngaomoa/52357461936/
Female
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/observation/Potanthus%20spp.%20_1665190495_236702.jpg
Female bottom.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/PotanthuSp_GirishMohan_an082.jpg


P. pallida is very similar & spots 4 & 5 are fully detached.
Spot 1b is broad. The veins crossing the FW band are strongly black.
Sri lanka.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-K_9vR_LQ-UM/Vo0KCQQEeNI/AAAAAAAAGQo/Ale7nwDESUQ/s1600/Untitled-1.jpg
Tripura.
https://www.scielo.cl/pdf/rche/v47n1/0718-8994-rche-47-01-35.pdf


TL Seow: Cheers.
PS. This example is probably the female Potanthus pallida.
FW spots 1b, 2 & 3 relatively wide with the veins strongly black.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/monsoon_jyoti_gogoi/4261887575
Compare female P. trachala; spots 1b ,2 & 3 narrow.
https://inaturalist-open-data.s3.amazonaws.com/photos/212486560/large.jpg
And female P. pseudomaesa; FW spot 4 less detached, veins not so black.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sites/default/files/observation/Potanthus%20spp.%20_1665190495_236702.jpg