Is this Psuedoborbo bevani?

[gkbaliga]

ID Help appreciated. As I remember, all four photos are of the same individual.
Shot in our home garden, Mangalore, Coastal part of Karnataka State, South India

1.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1830/28497579927_cd746afde6_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KqexEX)20170929-IMG_8632 (https://flic.kr/p/KqexEX) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

2.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1781/29496470138_c3ccfff0be_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/LWv7VY)20170929-IMG_8630 (https://flic.kr/p/LWv7VY) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

3.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/920/28497581057_96790b8959_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Kqey1r)20170929-IMG_8628 (https://flic.kr/p/Kqey1r) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

4.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/916/43366383711_6b1003f649_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/295941T)20170929-IMG_8622 (https://flic.kr/p/295941T) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

Thanks in advance.

[Psyche]

Yes it6 is a female Pseudoborbo bevani.

Borbo cinnara.Thorax with greenish hair ;FW spot in space 1b strongly present, spots 2 & 3 irregular with strongly concave margins; UnH with the spots well-defined.
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/BorboCinnara/BorboCinnara_AbhaySoman_an663.jpg

P. bevani Thorax more brown, FW spot in space 1b absent or vestigial, spot 2 & 3 regular , rounded ; UnH with the spots less defined.UnH spots well-defined.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8468/8141467426_20efa00688_h.jpg
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2014/187_1504-575-546d50d2810f0-1.jpg

P. bevani can also present an underside that is very confusingly similar toParnara bada.
The two can be differentiated thus.

Borbo/Pseudoborbo : FW subapical spots (ie spots 6 ,7, & 7)arranged in a curve, the lowest ( spot 6) shifted out from the two above it.
Female . Note FW subapical spots in a curve; large upper cellspot ; Lack of a spot in space 1b ; more gradual, less stubby antenna.
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2015/93_7901-157-55da96b8c920d-1.jpg
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2015/93_7901-157-55da96b8c920d-2.jpg
Male from Thailand.
http://butterfliesofthailand.blogspot.com/2015/10/182-bevans-swift-borbo-bevani.html

Parnara bada: FW subapical spots in a straight line; if only two(spot 6 & 7) are present they are well-aligned; antenna shorter ,thicker club.
http://dearlep.tw/images/Papilionoidea/Hesperiidae/%E5%A7%AC%E5%96%AE%E5%B8%B6%E5%BC%84%E8%9D%B6_DSC_ 1009_1.jpg
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/ParnaraSp/ParnaraSp_HemantOgale_aj190.jpg


TL Seow: Cheers.

[gkbaliga]

Thank you so much for the detailed explanation Dr. Seow

[gkbaliga]

These photos were taken on a separate day at the same place.
As far as I can remember all photos are of the same specimen.

Since this seems to match with the id pointers and description given to the earlier post, I presume this is also of the same species Pseudoborbo bevani Dr Seow?

5.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/922/42521723805_8b594c37eb_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/27MuX44)20171003-IMG_8819 (https://flic.kr/p/27MuX44) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

6.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1763/28556399717_44259eec24_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Kvr1Kg)20171003-IMG_8807 (https://flic.kr/p/Kvr1Kg) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

7.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1807/28556399417_c1de3f9183_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Kvr1E6)20171003-IMG_8805 (https://flic.kr/p/Kvr1E6) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

Thanks in advance

[Psyche]

Post 4. Female P. bevani.
After reading Evans there is a lot of variations in both species .
None of the stated features can be absolute.
Some revision of the description is necessary.

Borbo cinnara: UpF typically with a large non-hyaline spot in space 1b; Spots 2 & 3 usually with strongly concave outer margins, variable.
UnH with the cilia basally dark in male , wholly dark in female.
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/BorboCinnara/BorboCinnara_KSaji_ad960.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-jMZu5Yy4Yg0/U5srGBECJPI/AAAAAAAAduM/h_NUjDNPj3M/s1600/FS_adult_Federick_01.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Borbo%20cinnara%20cinnara/FS_adult_female_01.jpg



Pseudoborbo bevani.More golden brown; UpF with the spot in space 1b absent or vestigial/tiny ; Spots 2 & 3 often rounded but variable ;nos. of spots may be reduced.
UnH with the cilia uniformly light in both sexes; male usually have a pale area on the antenna.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/subhajit_pics/7042615117
https://farm9.static.flickr.com/8244/8487692432_d5d4c5c452_b.jpg
http://www.flutters.org/home/photogallery/index.php?level=picture&id=618
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-SzW2hylRQRU/TqwDN25FO7I/AAAAAAAAEk8/1VXLWGM-kDo/s1600/H31-1-1.jpg
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8195/8141436867_b4410130f9_h.jpg
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Close_wing_position_of_Pseudoborbo_bevani,_Mo ore,_1878_-_Beavan%27s_swift_WLB_DSC_2966.jpg

TL Seow: Cheers.

[gkbaliga]

Hmmm..... the going gets tougher as we move forward eh :what: Dr. Seow !

Thanks for all the knowledge.

[gkbaliga]

Is it possible to id this one Dr. Seow.

Please bear with my lack of knowledge / experience. There are only two spots on UNH and it looks as if there are spot / spots in cell.
Looking at the discal spots, it seems to me as not a P. Bevani (But I am not sure)

Could it be a totally different genus? Looking for guidance.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1798/43830227412_3fd7f12d85_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/29M8nA5)Blank (https://flic.kr/p/29M8nA5) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

[Psyche]

It is still P. bevani.
There is som smudges but no FW cellspot.
The UnH of bevani can a varying nos. of spots & sometimes none.
FW spot 3 is equidistant from spot 2 & 4 ; antenna without a pale area just below the club.

Compare with Caltoris kumara which always without cellspot. FW spot 3 is nearer spot 2; antenna with a pale area just below the club.
http://www.flutters.org/home/photogallery/plog-content/images/butterfliesbrnbspnbspnbsphesperiidae-the-skippers-br/subfamily-hesperiinae--brnbspnbspnbsp-genus-caltoris--swift-/blank-swift-caltoris-kumara_omkargodbole_1.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2015/118_8739-707-56192be3eeb85-1.jpg

TL Seow: Cheers.

[gkbaliga]

Hmm....
I need to still learn a lot. I will remember to look at the antenna before jumping to any conclusions, one of the basic mistakes I was making.

Regarding : "FW spot 3 is nearer spot 2", I had the impression that this is one of the characteristics of P. Bevani.
Now I am learning it is so for Caltoris Kumara.


Thank you so much Dr. Seow.

[Psyche]

Hmm....
I need to still learn a lot. I will remember to look at the antenna before jumping to any conclusions, one of the basic mistakes I was making.

Regarding : "FW spot 3 is nearer spot 2", I had the impression that this is one of the characteristics of P. Bevani.
Now I am learning it is so for Caltoris Kumara.


Thank you so much Dr. Seow.

You are quite right here. It should be the other way round. ie in C. kumara, spot 3 is usually more nearly equidistant from spot 2 & 4.
In P. bevani & B. cinnara spot 3 is a lot nearer spot 4 than spot 2.

In a top down view especially , the pale area on the antennal shaft may not always be visible.

Lastly the antennal club in both bevani & cinnara are much thicker.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2015/93_7901-157-55da96b8c920d-1.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/BorboCinnara/BorboCinnara_KSaji_ad960.jpg

Putting it all together an ID correction is necessary.

This does look good for Caltoris kumara kumara.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[gkbaliga]

I understnad these skippers are a tricky lot to identify, especially if we don't have enough shots from various angles.

Thanks for everything Dr. Seow.

[gkbaliga]

Hellow Dr Seow

Could this be Borbo cinnara?
Shot in our garden at Mangalore, Karnataka State, South India.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1960/44516823464_ef24b41dd2_m.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2aPNmF3)JPG-20181006-IMG_5008 (https://flic.kr/p/2aPNmF3) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

[Psyche]

These two are very difficult to separate in field shots.
Part of the blame is that in the net the IDs are all mixed up so that it is hard to gauge which is correct.

These images are all from Singapore where only Borbo cinnara occur.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-KaVjdL_FAME/U152N_2DObI/AAAAAAAAdUc/5BJKeJq6wCY/s1600/FS_adult_Khew_01.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-I6ExYM1XQvQ/UHozFkuHQUI/AAAAAAAAG18/cvzDIbiYWpE/s1600/DSC_0145-Borbo-cinnara.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Borbo%20cinnara%20cinnara/FS_male_Horace_01.jpg
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Borbo%20cinnara%20cinnara/FS_adult_female_01.jpg

http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/93060001.html

These images can reasonably said to be correct for Pseudoborbo bevani.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8335/8141433833_b41f535518_b.jpg
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2014/187_1504-575-546d50d2810f0-1.jpg
http://dearlep.tw/images/Papilionoidea/Hesperiidae/Borbo%20bevani%20%E5%81%87%E8%A4%90%E5%BC%84%E8%9D %B6_%E6%9D%8E%E6%A6%AE%E8%8A%B3.jpg
https://www.thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Borbo-bevani-1080x722.jpg
https://farm7.static.flickr.com/6076/6076980098_e8d6b655d5_b.jpg

http://yutaka.it-n.jp/hes/93070001.html


The main difference are ,B. cinara UnH spots sharply defined; antennal shaft mostly dark; UpF spots 2 & 3 irregular.
P. bevani ;UnH spotspoorly defined ,blurry; antennal shaft paler, often with a pale area behind the club; UpF spots smaller & rounded.


Your shot with sharply defined HW spots & dark antennae indicate it is a female Borbo cinnara.


TL Seow: Cheers.

[gkbaliga]

Thank you so much Dr. Seow.

Based on your earlier coaching, I made an informed guess this time. :):):)

[gkbaliga]

Could this be Caltoris Kumara Dr Seow? Both photos of the same individual. Shot in our garden, Mangalore, Coastal Area of Karnataka State, India September 2018

Wings are broad, only two supapical spots in FW, Spot 2,3,4 almost equidistant. Apparently no spot on UNH

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1966/45271150622_d6a135e3fe_m.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2bYstRG)20180901-IMG_4034 (https://flic.kr/p/2bYstRG) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1979/31445804998_d3daa10118_m.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/PUKYgG)20180901-IMG_4036 (https://flic.kr/p/PUKYgG) by GKBaliga (https://www.flickr.com/photos/93793400@N02/), on Flickr

Thanks in advance

[Psyche]

Post 15.
Yes this looks like Caltoris kumara.
Larger size FW- 20mm rounder wings. Antennal club slimmer vs Borbo & Parnara.
Underside HW with an ochreous overlay (appear as a speckling).
Male C. kumara with 2 subapical spots.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2014/153_1519-393-546db946b08c8-1.jpg
https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caltoris_kumara#/media/File:CaltorisKumara_826_1_Knight.png

Baoris have similar antennae but UnH without ochreous overlay.
B. chapmani subapical 1 or none. darker.
https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/media_images/2016/137_12179-51-57473d83d5b71-2.jpg


TL Seow: Cheers.

[gkbaliga]

Thanks Dr.Seow. Learning things slowly one by one with your assistance.