Arhopala atosia or lurida?

[atronox]

Found this Arhopala recently and didn't give much thought about it because i thought it was just another epimuta until i compared this to my other epimuta shots and noticed a few differences. The post-discal series on the hindwing seems quite different and i was wondering if it could be either an atosia or lurida that has lost its tails? The wing shape is also quite different.

25209

Here is a mating pair of what i know is definitely epimuta and you can see even the male(the one on the right) has more rounded wings than the above specimen.

25210

Thoughts?

[Psyche]

I actually thought you might have A. lurida because HW spot 4 & 5 are in line.

It is A. epimuta.
In A epimuta the dark marginal lines on both sides of vein 2 meet it straight on.
The shape of the spots can be deceptive.
https://www.thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Arhopala-epimuta-1080x675.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-onGDL0mCBhU/T9Sjz-GhnuI/AAAAAAAAGFQ/j_ntDjFDRO8/s640/DSC1092+Arhopala+epimuta+epiala.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-5yEN0kzk_Kg/UKpitX0NIdI/AAAAAAAAPjo/gnhhHhhjr74/s1600/AE_adult_02.jpg

In the tailed species the dark marginal lines on both side of vein 2 curved down into the tail.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Arhopala%20atosia%20malayana/A_atosia_01.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-TQqlnu16fFA/VOJnzpwS4gI/AAAAAAAAUAw/yUe6z0mA8lA/s1600/DSC_0136.JPG
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-VQ_bV9tsmjY/UOhDvdd4aII/AAAAAAAAIVM/Pr9mOZm0e2E/s1600/LKW+2096+Arhopala++lurida.jpg

Where the tail is broken off, the curving of the dark marginal lines is still evident.
https://species.wikimedia.org/wiki/Arhopala_lurida#/media/File:ArhopalaLuridaMUpUnAC1.jpg

TL Seow: Cheers.

[atronox]

In the tailed species the dark marginal lines on both side of vein 2 curved down into the tail

By this do you mean that the marginal lines taper as they approach the tail from both sides?

Also, for this group is the roundness of the spots critical for ID or is this also subject to variation? What about the clarity of the markings? Am asking because, for epimuta, this would be the most extreme, non-aberrant variant i've ever seen

Thanks

[Psyche]

By this do you mean that the marginal lines taper as they approach the tail from both sides?

Also, for this group is the roundness of the spots critical for ID or is this also subject to variation? What about the clarity of the markings? Am asking because, for epimuta, this would be the most extreme, non-aberrant variant i've ever seen

Thanks


I would have thought the images are self-explanatory.
In both A. lurida & atosia, the black margins on either of vein 2 curved out & converged to form a shallow 'V'.
Likewise the narrow white marginal band adjacent to them also do the same.
A. lurida.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-RsKPooOdJpw/Ur7VFXrh4kI/AAAAAAAANKA/3nXI5xyZz3M/s1600/HFH_0280+Arhopala+lurida+(TBC).jpg
A. atosia.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-TQqlnu16fFA/VOJnzpwS4gI/AAAAAAAAUAw/yUe6z0mA8lA/s1600/DSC_0136.JPG

Even if the tail is broken the 'V' features remain intact as seen below.
https://species.wikimedia.org/wiki/Arhopala_lurida#/media/File:ArhopalaLuridaMUpUnAC1.jpg

Your pix has a perpective distortion which make the FW appear too broad & may affect the shape of the spots ( ie. spots 6 & 7 are stretched horizontally).
It is somewhat like this Palmking. You may want to compare the shape of your specimen with the A. lurida given earlier.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/jayjayc/2116918581/

Horace example of A. epimuta also have rounded HW spots 6 & 7, so I can't see it as abnormal.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-5yEN0kzk_Kg/UKpitX0NIdI/AAAAAAAAPjo/gnhhHhhjr74/s1600/AE_adult_02.jpg
Also this male from Brunei.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arhopala_epimuta#/media/File:ArhopalaEpimutaEpimutaMFUpUnAC1.jpg

TL Seow: Cheers.

[atronox]

Ok i see what you mean. It is very subtle though. I'll need to look at more images to be more confident about the appearance of this character. Thanks Dr Seow

[atronox]

Here's another atypical pair i found recently where spots 6 and 7 are much more aligned than usual

25374

[Psyche]

Post 6.
Mating pair Arhopala lurida.Correction: Arhopala epimuta.
It is a pity the female on the left have HW spot 4 & 5 partly hidden.

The alignment of spot 6 & 7 is so variable that a lot of confusion was caused in the past.
This seem to occur in A. lurida.
The outward dislocation of FW spot 4 is very helpful, but occasionally the shift is very slight.

A. atosia is typically hair brown with poor contrast of the markings & HW spot 4 & 5 almost fully separated.
1 Singapore & 2 Malayan .
http://www.butterflycircle.com/checklist/mugshots/Arhopala%20atosia%20malayana/A_atosia_01.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-HeaqxUa0Tzk/VSM7cSq2OnI/AAAAAAAAUyk/Svg2H7kDUUE/s1600/DSC_0138.JPG
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-TQqlnu16fFA/VOJnzpwS4gI/AAAAAAAAUAw/yUe6z0mA8lA/s1600/DSC_0136.JPG

A. lurida Ground colour deeper brown with stronger contrast , HW spot 4 & 5 with much more overlap.
Thailand & Langkawi.
https://www.thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Arhopala-lurida.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-RsKPooOdJpw/Ur7VFXrh4kI/AAAAAAAANKA/3nXI5xyZz3M/s1600/HFH_0280+Arhopala+lurida+(TBC).jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-VQ_bV9tsmjY/UOhDvdd4aII/AAAAAAAAIVM/Pr9mOZm0e2E/s1600/LKW+2096+Arhopala++lurida.jpg

A. epimuta; Note dark marginal line cross over where the tail should be. Position of HW spot 4 & 5 variable.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-E6nq4fb9mDM/VQeUd8Pv0aI/AAAAAAAAUhA/XOhMGSnLmGQ/s1600/DSC_0060C.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-5yEN0kzk_Kg/UKpitX0NIdI/AAAAAAAAPjo/gnhhHhhjr74/s1600/AE_adult_02.jpg


TL Seow: Cheers.

[atronox]

Thanks Dr Seow. I didn't think it was anything other than epimuta but this is the first time i've seen spots 6 and 7 aligned like that for this species so i thought i'd share it