Separation of Thauria lathyi and T. aliris

[DaveChiangMai]

I found some older discussion of these two species on Butterfly Circle, but it did not seems to come to any conclusions on good features to separate these two confusing species. I attach a number of images, of which the three from Nan and Phrae provinces I have tentatively identified as aliris but would be interested in some feedback on how to separate these.

Image 1, from se Thailand, should be T. laythi, due to predominantly reddish tinge, and aliris being unrecorded from se Thailand.

Image 2. Is assumed T. laythi from Doi Suthep.

Image 3, 4 and 5 are assumed T. aliris, based purely on them not being very bright, but does wear affect this? Interested in feedback on any morphological differences. Many thanks

Image 1. T. layhti from Khao Soi Dao
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Image 2. Assumed T. laythi from Doi Suthep.
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Image 3. Assumed T. aliris from Phu Soi Dao (Nan province)
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Image 4. Assumed T. aliris from Wiang Kosai (Phrae province)
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Image 5. Assumed T. aliris from Tham Sakoen (Nan province).
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[Psyche]

The two species are practically identical in appearances.

In Vietnam there is only T. lathyi so the link below can be confidently validated.
http://butterfliesvietnam.blogspot.my/2015/07/thauria-lathyi-lathyi-jungleking.html
It appears the only difference is that the FW white band flared at both sides to the costa.
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-sLoWrigGAwM/WIG3HvxPonI/AAAAAAAAK6E/G9O1Lr77J0kZ-r2s7r41siVOQl6cx7IHgCLcB/s1600/Thauria%2Blathi3.jpg

In T. aliris the white band is of uniform width (typical) or only flared out on the inner side.
http://www.dnp.go.th/FOREMIC/NForemic/Caterpillars%20Food/Philips%20pet%20Caterpillar/Group%20Worm%201/Amathusiidae%20JPG/%E0%B8%9C%E0%B8%B5%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%AA%E0%B8%B7%E0%B 9%89%E0%B8%AD%E0%B9%80%E0%B8%88%E0%B9%89%E0%B8%B2% E0%B8%9B%E0%B9%88%E0%B8%B2%E0%B8%9B%E0%B8%B5%E0%B8 %81%E0%B8%9E%E0%B8%B9%E0%B9%88.html
https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3637/3430218776_9c4b5f69f1_b.jpg
https://wingscales.com/content/record/1895-1-25c4b.jpg
https://www.thaibutterflies.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Thauria-aliris.jpg
https://farm2.static.flickr.com/1645/24139374822_76ec0f4461_b.jpg
Examples from P. Malaysia in which white band is flared at inner side to costa.
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5536/9479029412_35c96cf360_o.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7432/9487063114_a806d16444_b.jpg
http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5442/9456315799_97e4a4321b_c.jpg

1 & 2 should be typical T. aliris.
3 is probably T. aliris.
4 & 5 could be T. lathyi.

TL Seow: Cheers.

[DaveChiangMai]

Thanks for the interesting feedback. Interestingly, there are no collected specimens mentioned in Yutaka or Kimura for aliris from se Thailand, whereas image 1 from Khao Soi Dao is from se Thailand, but indeed looks like aliris. Very confusing.

[Psyche]

This does'nt clear up the picture but adds to the confusion.

While the male T. lathyi have the FW band flared at the upper end (either one or both sides) the female have the band only slightly widened.

Thauria lathyi lathyi.
Laos.Female.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-k9VPXzkzjKI/TzR_WtYCHqI/AAAAAAAAGHM/3uewr5pB7Tw/s1600/%25E3%2583%25A9%25E3%2582%25AA%25E3%2582%25B9%25E3 %2581%25AE%25E8%259D%25B6%25E3%2580%2580%25EF%25BC %2593.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-y4ROvUch0qY/TzR_RNQOULI/AAAAAAAAGHA/gQ60tbvy-3Q/s1600/%25E3%2583%25A9%25E3%2582%25AA%25E3%2582%25B9%25E3 %2581%25AE%25E8%259D%25B6%25E3%2580%2580%25EF%25BC %2594.jpg
http://insectsubaru.blogspot.my/2012/02/
Vietnam Males.
http://www.vncreatures.net/chitiet.php?page=5&loai=3&ID=247
http://butterfliesvietnam.blogspot.my/2015/07/thauria-lathyi-lathyi-jungleking.html

Thauria lathyi amplifascia. male & female.
http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sp/2806/Thauria-aliris


Male Thauria aliris psedaliris male showing HW hair tufts.
https://www.aureus-butterflies.de/WebRoot/Store18/Shops/17926950/5883/9B48/87A4/31D5/508C/C0A8/2BBA/3D6C/SAM_8139.JPG


Based on the locations, either too far east or north, 1 to 5 are probably Thauria lathyi.
( At least 3, 4 & 5 look to be typical T. lathyi lathyi. )

TL Seow: Cheers.

[DaveChiangMai]

Many thanks for the additional information. Helps.