Pictures from Kaeng Krachan NP, Thailand

[guldsmed]

First three, that have tried ti ID to species:

Ixias pyrene, Junonia iphita and Tagiades japetus

then one where I only get as far as genus: Euploea and finally a very caterpillar, that i saw crossing a small stream.

More from same place and same month will follow later...

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And the pics

[Painted Jezebel]

Congratulations on the upperside of the Ixias verna. I have not managed one in 4 years, though it is only an infrequent visitor here on Samui.

The cat is, I think, a moth.

Finally, I believe that you have at least two species of Euploea here. There are some with smaller marginal spots in the hindwing, and a few subapical spots on the forewing. These are, I think, E. core. Those, without the forewing spots are probably E. algea. I have never seen such a concentration of Euploea before. What was on the ground to cause this?

[Psyche]

The opened wing guy have revealed its identity! It shows the two long brands in space 1b of Euploea sylvester. All those with bluish discal spots on the forewing are the same species. E. sylvester have a lustrous blue sheen somewhat like E. mulciber in flight.

The second with the rounded forewing with a pointed tip and a tracery of marginal and submarginal dots is E. klugii.

Again a change in name! If the taxon verna is considered a species seperate from pyrene, then the Malayan race birdi will need to be changed to I. verna birdi.

TL Seow:cheers:

PS : It is actually difficult to tell with certainty between E. eunice & klugii. While klugii is smaller than sylvester this appears larger. I am basing the ID on the larger hindwing spots which in eunice is reduced to smaller dots, but a northern race of eunice might have large spots.

[Painted Jezebel]

Again a change in name! If the taxon verna is considered a species seperate from pyrene, then the Malayan race birdi will need to be changed to I. verna birdi.



My mistake. We have Ixias pyrene verna here, and I forgot the 'pyrene' bit!:embrass: I definitely meant to say I. pyrene. No change of name here, sorry.

I can't see those brands on the opened winged guy, but it is probably my eyesight.:old: I'd go with Seow's opinion regarding the Euploea.

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Thx again :-)

The Tagiades japetus and Junonia iphitaare correct as no one protest?

The pic of the Euploea only show a tiny part of what was there, I guess there were 20-50 times more! It was just behind the toilet building and there was a dripping water tab and perhaps other substances were leaking.

Nearby the rangers also water areas of gravel and thereby attract many butterflies, making the area around the Park HQ a splendid place to watch butterflies, and nearby is a small stream also with lots of butterflies and odonates too on the banks... Could there even be 3 species of Euploea? On the upper right is one with a lot more forewing spots than any of the rest...

I know the cat is a moth, but just hoped someone had an idea anyway, it was enormous - easily the biggest larvae I have ever seen :-).

I will add to this thread later, I have some more butterflies from the same area :-)

[Great Mormon]

Thats the first time I've seen a caterpillar cross a stream. I always though that they would get washed away by the flow of water. I'm not sure about the IDs of the 2 species, sorry.

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I am certainly not sure, if it would have been washed away. I thought it so likely, that I aided it getting to the bank it was heading towards :-)

[Commander]

The Tagiades japetus and Junonia iphitaare correct as no one protest?

I'd say that you are right on those two. Junonia iphita which is known as the Chocolate Soldier in Malaysia, is closely related to our Chocolate Pansy in Singapore.

The Common Snow Flat (Tagiades japetus) matches the reference books.

[Great Mormon]

I am certainly not sure, if it would have been washed away. I thought it so likely, that I aided it getting to the bank it was heading towards :-)

Perhaps its finding for a safe place to pupate? I remember having a birdwing caterpillar escaping through a tear in the netting of its box cover and pupating about 10 metres away.

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Some more pics.

Can the Ideopsis (I think) be ID'ed to species level?

Is the Phaedyma columella correct or could it be some Neptis instead?


A dead (trodden upon?) Euploea sp.

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3 installment

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Perhaps its finding for a safe place to pupate? I remember having a birdwing caterpillar escaping through a tear in the netting of its box cover and pupating about 10 metres away.

Very likely, I thought that either this (looking for pupation site) was the case or it had accidentally fallen to a small island of rocks in the middle of the stream, and it was now trying to get out :-)

[Psyche]

1 Neptis hylas.
2 Parantica algea.
3 Euploea modesta. Note the forewing have no brand.

The next three are correct.

After realising there is E. modesta I scrutinised the group photo and realised there are five species.

The 2 in front & 2 to the left with large white submarginal spots ,& the forewing margin rather straight are E. modesta.

The opened wing butt is E. sylvester. Hope you can see the 2 brands on the forewing by looking slanting down.

To the right of the open wingtip is a dark butt with pointed forewing and small white dots on the hindwing. This is E. eunice.

To the right of eunice & to the back are 2 with the forewing apex and margin rounded; also hindwing spots smaller than modesta. These are E. sylvester.

Right of these two is one in which the forewing is rounded but the apex is pointed. A second with less spotting is also present in front. These two should be E. klugii.

2 butts on the right upper margin. First is probably sylvester but the darker one at the back with more forewing spotting is E. mulciber.

Finally ,at the back, left margin is probably E. sylvester although it have a tracery of marginal forewing spots; the one on the rock should be an E. modesta.

[guldsmed]

That is really amazing, 5 species in that little part of the whole group. I wonder if there were even more in the big group... How many species of Euploea are there in total in Thailand?

I have tried to label them in the pic, to see if I understood you correctly. My understnding of your explanation are labeled in red, I tried to guess a few more from your characters and labeled those in green :-). There are still a few left without letters :-)

s= sylvester, m= modesta, eu=eunice, mu=mulciber, k=klugii

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Did I learn something then? After the first answer I wrote klugii on this one, but after the second explanation I think it must be modesta, but probaly I got it wrong:embrass:

[Painted Jezebel]

How many species of Euploea are there in total in Thailand?

[/I]

I know of 15 species of Euploea in Thailand, and have heard that a 16th has been found, though I have no confirmation of that.

[Psyche]

Did I learn something then? After the first answer I wrote klugii on this one, but after the second explanation I think it must be modesta, but probaly I got it wrong:embrass:

You got it right. Having said that I did a check on the underside of E. midamus and it looks similar, but the shorter forewing of modesta helps to ID it.

In the group photo, of the 4 you marked M the 2 on the right behind klugii are probably sylvester but I am just guessing from the wingshape.

TL Seow:cheers:

[Silverstreak]

I can't see those brands on the opened winged guy, but it is probably my eyesight.:old: I'd go with Seow's opinion regarding the Euploea.


The opened wing guy have revealed its identity! It shows the two long brands in space 1b of Euploea sylvester.

I think this is what Seow is referring to, enhanced and arrowed to make it easier to see.

:cheers:

[guldsmed]

You got it right. Having said that I did a check on the underside of E. midamus and it looks similar, but the shorter forewing of modesta helps to ID it.

In the group photo, of the 4 you marked M the 2 on the right behind klugii are probably sylvester but I am just guessing from the wingshape.

TL Seow:cheers:

After sending I looked again, and got the same idea for the one at the very back, but the wingshape of the two does not look totally the same to me, could it be one of each, with the back one being sylvester and the one in front of it modester?

Thx again for all your (I mean all of you and especially Psyche and Painted Jezebel) help and patience with this bookless newbie (at least regarding South East Asia).

:thumbsup: :

P.S. Thx to Silverstreak for showing the brands, I was not sure what the term meant, but now I see them :-). What are they? Androconial scales?

[Psyche]

I think this is what Seow is referring to, enhanced and arrowed to make it easier to see.

:cheers:

Sunny, Thnx for highlighting the brands.:thumbsup:


After sending I looked again, and got the same idea for the one at the very back, but the wingshape of the two does not look totally the same to me, could it be one of each, with the back one being sylvester and the one in front of it modester?

Thx again for all your (I mean all of you and especially Psyche and Painted Jezebel) help and patience with this bookless newbie (at least regarding South East Asia).

:thumbsup: :

P.S. Thx to Silverstreak for showing the brands, I was not sure what the term meant, but now I see them :-). What are they? Androconial scales?

Perspective gets distorted in pics so it is hard to judge wingshape and the size of the spots, but notice the one in front still have a rounded forewing margin compared to the two modesta in front. It is not perfectly in profile view.

Yes, the brands are specialised androconial scales.

TL Seow:cheers:

[guldsmed]

Thx again Seow!

I will put more pictures in this thread later :-D

By the way, I guess the lycaenid in the E. modesta picture is out of ID range for even the hardcore guys of this site?

[Psyche]

By the way, I guess the lycaenid in the E. modesta picture is out of ID range for even the hardcore guys of this site?

When the butt is out of focus, markings like spots and bands always appeared bigger and wider than they really are.

Based on the positions of all the black spots on the hindwing and the markings on the forewing I'll hazard a guess that it is Celastrina lavendularis.

By the way, the Parantica is P. aglea not algea. A typo error.

TL Seow:cheers:

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Looks like a very good guess when I google it :-)

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Another 6, 4 pierids, one swallowtail and one lycaenid. These are not from inside the park, but very near it in the garden of the resort just outside, where I stayed.

[Painted Jezebel]

The first Eurema species appears to have only 2 cell spots on the forewing, and no spot at the base of cell 7 on the hindwing. This leaves only E. hecabe and E. ada. I would suspect the former, but I can not be sure.

The photo of Eurema simulatrix shows three spots in the forewing cell. This makes it Eurema blanda. I can not be sure of the subspecies as the differences are in the black markings of the upperside, and I do not know how far north E. blanda blanda goes before being replaced by E. blanda silhetana.

You actually have a second species in the photo of Cepora narissa. The larger specimen on the left is Appias olferna olferna.

The small lycaenid is Prosotas dubiosa lumpura.

[Psyche]

The first pic is definitely E. hecabe with its squarish hindwing, and ada also have very rounded forewings.

Should not the P. aristolochiae be subspecies goniopeltis with its bigger rose spots.

Les, I see more name change with Appias olferna.

TL Seow:cheers:

[Painted Jezebel]

Les, I see more name change with Appias olferna.



Apparently so! Not sure of the reason. I will need to check the reasoning behind this tomorrow. Name taken from Pisuth's book, and is not listed in the 19 page errata.

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Thx a lot again both of you, I expected the Eurema to be wrong, as I have no idea, what marks to look for in this genus, glad that you help me out and even give some characters to look for - much appreciated!

Some more, looks like old friends but I am probably wrong again...

Castalius rosimon and Prosotas dubiosa lumpura? Now we are inside K K NP again.

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One more where I feel I must be right or at least close...

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Three pics of the same individual, Pareronia anais anais?

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Neptis hylas again?

[Psyche]

As far as I can see you got all right though the northern Pierids are Les' specialty.

TL Seow:cheers:

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Thx Seow, now I think I have butterflies only for one more round of questions from KK NP + a few dragons for the other forum :-)

But I still have pics from other places, so not finished asking questions just yet...

[guldsmed]

Actually I thought I had vanother handfull, but there is only one. I guess it is not an additional species but the female of Ixias pyrene?

[Painted Jezebel]

As far as I can see you got all right though the northern Pierids are Les' specialty.

TL Seow:cheers:

Yes, everything correct here. There are two female forms of Pareronia anais anais, this if f. anais. The form f. lutea has yellow markings along the hind wing dorsum.