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Thread: ID Help for Pelopidas sp.

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  1. #1
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    Default ID Help for Pelopidas sp.

    Greetings for the Festival of Lights - Happy Deepawali Dr. Seow

    Can this be identified as Pelopidas mathias? Shot at our Home, Mangalore, Karnataka State, South India, West Coast.

    I notice these : UN brown uneven, with paler marginal areas


    20181112-IMG_5455 by GKBaliga, on Flickr
    Regards gkbaliga

  2. #2
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    I do agree it is Pelopidas mathias.

    It does get tricky in some cases.
    Here are examples of Indian P. agna & mathias.

    P. mathias male.
    https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...asambe_(2).jpg
    Female .Taken in Africa. P. mathias occur throughout sub-Saharan Africa.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Pelopidas_sp.jpg
    P. mathias female India.
    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/me...88e37405-1.jpg

    P. agna males.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelopi...18_09_2012.jpg
    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/me...gale_ak890.jpg
    P. agna female.
    https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...a_20140621.jpg


    TL Seow: Cheers.
    Last edited by Psyche; 16-Nov-2018 at 07:30 AM. Reason: Error Image.

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    Dr. T L Seow Sir,
    What will be the id key pointer for Pelopidas thrax, mathias, agna. Please guide.

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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflyrajib View Post
    Dr. T L Seow Sir,
    What will be the id key pointer for Pelopidas thrax, mathias, agna. Please guide.
    This is a tough one.
    I will like to know first if P. thrax is found in South India .
    From the book it seem to be Pakistan ,Punjab, Delhi to Sikkim & Manipur (as ssp masta).

    From the underside it is very similar to P. mathias with white shadings.
    It will be necessary to determine if images from S. India are P. thrax or P. mathias dsf.


    TL Seow: Cheers.
    PS. I presume P. thrax may have been recorded in your area ,West Bengal.

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    Thanks T L Seow Sir. Actually if we know them perfectly then finding chances will be high (for me). Always I am going with male sex band and imaginery line (UPF nearer cell spots) which was make me very much confused.

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    Thank you so much for all the help Dr. Seow.
    Regards gkbaliga

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    Greetings for South India Dr Seow

    ID help requested on following two specimens.

    I have only one UN view image of this one. Is it possible to identify it? Image shot in our home garden, Mangalore, Coastal Karnataka, South India in November 2017
    20171104-IMG_0227 by GKBaliga, on Flickr



    The following two pictures are of the same individual shot at Sammilan Shetty Butterfl Park, Belvai, (On the base of Western Ghats) near Mangalore, Karnataka, South India in Sept 2017
    I am unable to fix the id at Pelopidas mathias / agna / subochracea / conjuncta. Though P. subochracea is usually found in deep forest with bamboo plantations, some authors are of the view
    that they occur in urban and semiurban areas also because of the ornamental bamboo being planted in gardens.

    JPG-20170919-P1040788 by GKBaliga, on Flickr

    JPG-20170919-P1040790 by GKBaliga, on Flickr


    The following one shot at our home in Mangalore, Coastal Karnataka, South India in June 2017

    P1080565 by GKBaliga, on Flickr
    Regards gkbaliga

  8. #8
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    Post 12.

    1. Pelopidas agna male. subapical spots are well out of line.
    The underside is quite evenly brown though there is a marginal b'band' which appear more structural ,than die to clour change.
    Male & female.
    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/me...gale_ak890.jpg
    https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/579/22...f00c7df8_b.jpg

    P. mathias male & female :Diffuse pale shadins marginal & UnH centrally.
    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/me...88e37405-1.jpg
    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/me...5811259b-1.jpg

    2 & 3 Female P. agna. Pix 2 shows UnF marginal area evenly brown.

    Female P. agna; aline thru the 2 cellspots move away from the spot in space 1b.
    http://www.butterflycircle.com/check..._female_02.jpg
    Female P. mathias ;a line thru the cellspots moves near or cut spot 1b.
    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-eYsLtkDVM7...perside_02.jpg

    4.. Female probably P. mathiasA line thru the FW cellspots move towards spot 1b; spot 2 more crescentic.


    P. subochracea; Large ;FW subapical spots more in line; celspots large.
    UnH spots reduced , often spot 2, 3, 6, (as in Borbo) with spot 6 biggest; spot are slightly dark-rimmed.
    Marginal areas may be lightly paler.
    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/sp...as-subochracea

    Pelopias conjunctus/conjuncta.Large.
    FW spots distinctly yellow; UnH spots white.
    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/me...Saji_ac764.jpg


    TL Seow: Cheers.

  9. #9
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    Thanks for the identification of original Image posted by me Dr Seow.

    Even I am interested in the question of our good friend Rajib.

    Let us assume we have UP view along with UN view also.
    How can we differentiate between the three species? P. mathias, P. agna, P.thrax.
    Broad guidelines also sufficient now.

    No. We do not have P. thrax in South India.

    Synoptic Catalogue (Varshney and Smetacek) says

    221. Pelopidas thrax (Huebner, [1821]) Small Branded Swift
    i. Pelopidas thrax masta Evans, 1949
    Sikkim to N.E. India.
    ii. Pelopidas thrax thrax (Huebner, [1821])
    Jammu & Kashmir to Delhi & Gujarat.

    We have heard of reported presence of Pelopidas thrax masta occurence in West Bengal, but it is not confirmed by voucher copy and genitalia studies. Hence we do not have confirmation as of now. The reports are based on images. So we would like to understand pictorial id first before more evidence can be found.
    Regards gkbaliga

  10. #10
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    Angry

    I think they can be ID'ed especially with fresh individuals.


    Pelopidas thrax; P thrax thrax ,Mediterranean to Delhi. ssp masta Sikkim & Manipur.

    1.Male brand whitish.
    2 .FW upper cellspot often teardrop shape ( horizontally).
    3. UnH spots distinctly margined with dark brown; some spots reduced to dark rings.
    4. Underpart of body ie. head, thorax, & abdomen strongly whitish.
    5. Ssp mastaUnH spots mostly dark rings except spots 4 & 5.
    Greek islands.
    https://www.researchgate.net/profile...2007-Right.png
    http://www.pyrgus.de/Pelopidas_thrax_en.html
    Turkey
    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-eccwOVlYqY..._2649%252B.jpg

    There are pix in which the marginal areas are pale shaded much as in P. mathias from S. India, but the pix are from Africa.
    Nigeria.
    http://tolweb.org/Pelopidas_thrax

    P. agna.
    1 UpF male with spot 2 & 3 very narrow & rectangular .
    2. Male brand dark.
    3. UnH uniformly ochreous brown .
    4. UnH spots not dark-ringed.

    https://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/me...Saji_ac952.jpg
    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...18_09_2012.jpg
    female
    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...a_20140621.jpg


    Pelopidas mathias.
    1, Male brand dark.
    2. FW spot 2 & 3 quadrate.
    3. UnH greyer with pale marginal shading .
    4. UnH spots not dark-ringed.


    TL Seow: Cheers.

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