Jamides ID

[Psyche]

What about this pair, Seow? The uppersides appear very whitish blue, but I didn't take a second look, assuming it to be the usual species that we encounter.

A lovely shot of a pair, Khew.
It is celeno though the marginal band on the hindwing are a bit macular.
Cheers & Happy New Year.

That mating pair looks rather similar to the one I posted.

Dr. Seow, I went back to the same place where I shot the mating pair. There is a colony there but every single one I observed appeared to be J. Celeno. The upperside has a border of black and the underside white striae are straight. Is there a chance that the mating pair I posted above is indeed celeno?

i also shot another Jamides that looked identical to the one i posted in picture #2. is this a male or a female? i ask because the upperside is pale blue with a thick black border.


Untitled by LemonTeaYK, on Flickr


The Metallic Caerulean by LemonTeaYK, on Flickr
picture taken yesterday of another specimen. same sp?

Yes, There is a good possibility the mating pair you took is celeno given the variability of the species. However as the marginal band is highly macular (spot-like) especially the female on the right, this is worth checking.
A google search of J. celeno aelianus shows 95% of the correct images with the marginal spots flat & the other 5% slightly macular.

One exception is Federick's shot of this female with the marginal band macular & the submarginal band composed of lunulate (moon-shaped) spots.
Not sure if this is merely a variant of celeno.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_0EK80AsaR7...-Caerulean.jpg

A pair of ssp. aelianus from Thailand.
http://species.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...sMFUpUnAC1.jpg

The one you shot (untitled) is J. alecto. The clue to the ID is the upperside pale blue with thick black border.
It is a male. Note the short black palpi 3rd segments. (compare next & mating pair.)
(I am puzzled as this looks like a J. elpis male, but only the alecto male has black border on the forewing.)

The separation of elpis & alecto can be very difficult.
J. alecto is often large, but smaller individuals also occur.
All those diiferences I said before are rather inconsistent & requires a good dose of salt.
In set specimens, the forewing discal striae (inner 2) thickens more in the lower 3rd of the forewing than in elpis.
This view is largely hidden in photos.
AS you can see, Horace's bred elpis female looks almost identical to the male alecto you shot.
Here the marginal white stria of the hindwing black spot is certainly thicker than the 3rd stria from base.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_yzw2AzY2du...Horace+Tan.jpg

In Singapore if you see the "barb" mark it is always alecto..
However, there are some without this mark.

TL Seow

[MinuteMaid]

A lovely shot of a pair, Khew.
It is celeno though the marginal band on the hindwing are a bit macular.
Cheers & Happy New Year.




Yes, There is a good possibility the mating pair you took is celeno given the variability of the species. However as the marginal band is highly macular (spot-like) especially the female on the right, this is worth checking.
A google search of J. celeno aelianus shows 95% of the correct images with the marginal spots flat & the other 5% slightly macular.

One exception is Federick's shot of this female with the marginal band macular & the submarginal band composed of lunulate (moon-shaped) spots.
Not sure if this is merely a variant of celeno.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_0EK80AsaR7...-Caerulean.jpg

A pair of ssp. aelianus from Thailand.
http://species.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...sMFUpUnAC1.jpg

The one you shot (untitled) is J. alecto. The clue to the ID is the upperside pale blue with thich black border.
It is a male. Note the short black palpi 3rd segments. (compare next & mating pair.)

The separation of elpis & alecto can be very difficult.
J. alecto is often large, but smaller individuals also occur.
All those diiferences I said before are rather inconsistent & requires a good dose of salt.
In set specimens, the forewing discal striae (inner 2) thickens more in the lower 3rd of the forewing than in elpis.
This view is largely hidden in photos.
AS you can see, Horace's bred elpis female looks almost identical to the male alecto you shot.
Here the marginal white stria of the hindwing black spot is certainly thicker than the 3rd stria from base.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_yzw2AzY2du...Horace+Tan.jpg

In Singapore if you see the "barb" mark it is always alecto..
However, there are some without this mark.

TL Seow

thanks again for all the help Dr. Seow!

[Psyche]

Your untitled shot looks too much like an J. elpis male, but only the alecto male has a black border.
The male alecto usually has longer forewing with straight margin.

There are a number of pairs of sibling species in which one is commonly photographed while the other is hardly seen although not a rare species.

Jamides celeno & J pura.
Prosotas nora & pia.

The implication is that the 2nd species of the pair has been mostly mis-Id'ed as the first on the web.

TL Seow

[MinuteMaid]

Your untitled shot looks too much like an J. elpis male, but only the alecto male has a black border.
The male alecto usually has longer forewing with straight margin.

There are a number of pairs of sibling species in which one is commonly photographed while the other is hardly seen although not a rare species.

Jamides celeno & J pura.
Prosotas nora & pia.

The implication is that the 2nd species of the pair has been mostly mis-Id'ed as the first on the web.

TL Seow

Dr. Seow,

The untitled specimen has a border too thick to be a male. It is definitely a female. The lighter upperside color also suggests that.

It looks almost identical to the other one I posted yesterday which was IDed as J. Alecto. Both in upperside and underside.

Thus, I think both Jamides are females, and of the same species. But as of now, I'm not sure if it is elpis or alecto.

I understand it may be quite challenging to ID, considering you don't have an upperside view to see. And in most cases, the forewing is not lifted high enough to compare the striae.

[Psyche]

Untitled by LemonTeaYK, on Flickr

This untitled shot looks like female but the very short palpi 3rd segment indicates male.

Male J. elpis
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_yzw2AzY2du...udelpis-01.jpg
Female J. elpis.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_rzo8wjfyCs..._female_03.jpg




The Metallic Caerulean by LemonTeaYK, o

This is a female J. alecto. The palpi are longer.
The bulging abdomen & tip confirms it.

Another female J. alecto.
http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6021/...06bc5ef817.jpg
A typical male J. alecto.
http://www.butterflycircle.com/check...0-%20Sunny.jpg

TL Seow

[Psyche]

After looking at various images & particularly the full size image on your website, I have to say the palpi are long enough to be a female.

So it is a female and a J. alecto.

The interesting fact is the female elpis has much longer palpi than the female alecto, a very useful ID feature for differentiation of the 2 species.

TL Seow

PS. Likewise, the palpi 3rd segment of the male elpis is longer that that of the male alecto.
Again a useful guide if you have the sexes right.