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Green Baron
28-Dec-2004, 09:28 PM
How do you guys identify Com Dartlet ? Based on the C&P4 keys, I find it hard to tell the genus apart (pg 379), not to mention the species (Pg 380) :-(

Care to share your insight so that we can be more accurate when ID these orange skippers ?

The reason I am asking is because Rosalind would like to have a photo of Com Dartlet for the information counter and I don't think we should give her a photo which we are not 100% sure of the ID.

Khew,
Maybe you can post the upperside and underside of the orange skippers you have ID and we can put them side by side for comparison.


BTW, these are some of the 'Com Darlet' posted in this forum.

Neo
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v493/lepi/0001-0500/0064.jpg
http://imagehost.biz/ims/pictes/58267.jpg
http://imagehost.biz/ims/pictes/58266.jpg
Simon
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v492/simonsng2/12052004%20-%20AH/common_dartlet_3218.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v492/simonsng2/11212004%20-%20AH/unknown_skipper_3075.jpg
YL
http://zookeeper.clubsnap.org/gallery/albums/butts200409/20041127_01.jpg

Khew

Commander
28-Dec-2004, 09:47 PM
Ok. I have a few shots which are positively identified, so I can pass you those.

Frankly speaking, in this series, I think Simon's shots are not of the Common Dartlet.

Green Baron
28-Dec-2004, 09:54 PM
I think Simon's look more like TAQ

Commander
28-Dec-2004, 09:56 PM
No, they both appear to have the apiculus, so definitely not the Taractrocera genus.

Green Baron
28-Dec-2004, 10:03 PM
I think Simon's look more like TAQTyped too fast. I thought Neo's first 2 do not look like Com dartlet. #3 looks like TAQ ?

These orange fellas are so confusing :prrr: .

Elbowed Pierrot
28-Dec-2004, 10:08 PM
sorry to 'butt' in, but aint the common charactertisc of the common dart, the black vertical strip on the hindwings? which no other skippers have?

Green Baron
28-Dec-2004, 10:10 PM
I have posted your the Com Dartlet shots (from here (http://www.butterflypals.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12871&postcount=20)) for comparison.
Simon's are not Com Darlet.

Commander
28-Dec-2004, 10:11 PM
Typed too fast. I thought Neo's first 2 do not look like Com dartlet. #3 looks like TAQ ?

These orange fellas are so confusing :prrr: .

They do look like Common Dartlets. #3 is also definitely not a Taractrocera. Note the hooked apiculus which is clearly seen in the shot.

Yes, they are definitely confusing. Still examining the many that I have. For the local ones, there is always an element of doubt regarding the Potanthus spp. C&P4 records a number of others besides P. omaha. We haven't even scratched the surface of this genus yet.

We are now only separating the Taractrocera and Oriens genus from Potanthus. Also, don't forget the Telicota. Many field shots do not give an indication of the scale of the butt, so that adds more difficulties in separating this genus from the smaller Potanthus. :stupid:

And to add to the confusion, I had an email from an Australian collector who notes that he captured a specimen of Cephrenes acalle niasicus (Page 433 of C&P4 says it's found in Singapore). Take a look at the male - Plate 58 Specimen 25. Can't even differentiate it, if we don't put the Telicotas side-by-side with it, what more try to ID one from a field shot! :stupid: :stupid:

Commander
28-Dec-2004, 10:12 PM
sorry to 'butt' in, but aint the common charactertisc of the common dart, the black vertical strip on the hindwings? which no other skippers have?

Haven't been reading the ID Key in C&P4, have we? :nono:

Elbowed Pierrot
28-Dec-2004, 10:15 PM
Haven't been reading the ID Key in C&P4, have we? :nono:

nope :confused: ;P

Green Baron
28-Dec-2004, 10:17 PM
That was why I din't bother to ID and just dump all of them in a folder call Orange Skippers :bsmile: .

Commander
28-Dec-2004, 10:19 PM
That was why I din't bother to ID and just dump all of them in a folder call Orange Skippers :bsmile: .

Good strategy. :bsmile:

Anyway, thanks to Neo, who helped to separate the TAQ from the others. Now waiting for Dr Kirton to help confirm the ID before we add to the Singapore Checklist.

Green Baron
28-Dec-2004, 10:30 PM
No, they both appear to have the apiculus, so definitely not the Taractrocera genus.
Any idea what they are ? I shot quite a number of them at AH, HVHG and USR.

BTW, how come the 2nd and 3rd shot of your Com Dartlet don't show any apiculus ?

Commander
28-Dec-2004, 10:33 PM
Any idea what they are ? I shot quite a number of them at AH, HVHG and USR.

BTW, how come the 2nd and 3rd shot of your Com Dartlet don't show any apiculus ?

The DOF is so shallow that the very fine apiculus sometimes doesn't show up. I believe Neo also experienced this. Fortunately with digicams these days, we tend to blast of several shots at many angles. The same specimen shows an apiculus in some shots, whilst it 'disappears' in other shots.

#1 and #2 are actually shots of the same specimen. Note the leaf.